BOSS 302 streeter -- Mid August!!!

[68fastback]

Ok, I'm watching the Conti series from Milville NJ (Roush #16 won ...held off the BMWs -- yeah!!!), and the announcer is talking about how the Roush multimatic is doing so well and the BOSS 302 have had a lot of niggling problems (power steering).

So, he lets out something like this: Its sort of odd that we have these BOSS 302R already racing while the street BOSS 302 doesn't get released until two weeks into August!

No context on whether he was talking about the limited-build SE street-BOSS302 or the volume-build street-BOSS302, but what he said was very clear -- mid August BOSS302 -- dunno, since I heard it's two weeks into December ...maybe that's the 'other' one? -lol

---

Anyhow, why are the BOSS 302s all the way back in the pack finishing 11th-13th, while the Roush FR500C wins? Maybe there's more to Roush staying with the older Cammer for this season? Strategically it may make sense but what's the cause of the disparity? Power? Handling?

From talking with the BOSS 302 drivers at Lime Rock they say the 5.0 BOSS302 it's super-strong right up to 7500 rpm redline -- so what else is different? Suspension? If so, why not just run the same the set-up as Roush since I doubt it's secret what pieces they're using tho they sure have more experience tweaking it all together.

By the way, the top Bowtie 6.2 (Sunoco) came in 6th -- about where it's been in the past. But why were all the BOSS 302s so sluggish at Millville? It was a very hot day at Millville, they said, but it was hot for everyone and they're all NA anyway.

Anyone with any insight??

[Tommy Gun]

I think this is the race I watched a little of?

Mini Cooper was gaining some good ground and all the Camaro had problems and even were catching on fire. :rofl3:


.

[68fastback]

mini-cooper won it's class -- it's first win of the season.

[JTB]

Will the Performance of the forthcoming BOSS 302 come close to the '11 GT500?

[Cobra Drifter]

Misses it by 198













:rofl3:

[Carnut]

Will the Performance of the forthcoming BOSS 302 come close to the '11 GT500?

If they don't add a bunch of weight to it.

[Birdman]

Ok, I'm watching the Conti series from Milville NJ (Roush #16 won ...held off the BMWs -- yeah!!!), and the announcer is talking about how the Roush multimatic is doing so well and the BOSS 302 have had a lot of niggling problems (power steering).

So, he lets out something like this: Its sort of odd that we have these BOSS 302R already racing while the street BOSS 302 doesn't get released until two weeks into August!

No context on whether he was talking about the limited-build SE street-BOSS302 or the volume-build street-BOSS302, but what he said was very clear -- mid August BOSS302 -- dunno, since I heard it's two weeks into December ...maybe that's the 'other' one? -lol

---

Anyhow, why are the BOSS 302s all the way back in the pack finishing 11th-13th, while the Roush FR500C wins? Maybe there's more to Roush staying with the older Cammer for this season? Strategically it may make sense but what's the cause of the disparity? Power? Handling?

From talking with the BOSS 302 drivers at Lime Rock they say the 5.0 BOSS302 it's super-strong right up to 7500 rpm redline -- so what else is different? Suspension? If so, why not just run the same the set-up as Roush since I doubt it's secret what pieces they're using tho they sure have more experience tweaking it all together.

By the way, the top Bowtie 6.2 (Sunoco) came in 6th -- about where it's been in the past. But why were all the BOSS 302s so sluggish at Millville? It was a very hot day at Millville, they said, but it was hot for everyone and they're all NA anyway.

Anyone with any insight??

Easy answer ......Roush has something to prove to Ford because Roush lost the bid to build the Boss 302R to Multimatic. I spoke with the Roush team manager while I was at LimeRock just before you arrived there Dan. Believe me Roush is not happy with the decision makers at Ford because of this. There is no company out there that even comes close to Roush when it comes to having the Racing manufacturing testing facilitys, race experience and resources at their disposal. Multimatic doesn't even come close. So because of this Roush is out to send a message to Ford by consistantly running up front using the old cammer engine instead of the new Boss302R engine which actually makes less power than the new Boss 302R engine.

[Carnut]

You guys have all the fun. :ballchain:

[JTB]

Misses it by 198

















:rofl3:




http://image3.examiner.com/images/blog/EXID28964/images/nuclear-bomb-badger350.jpg

[68fastback]

Easy answer ......Roush has something to prove to Ford because Roush lost the bid to build the Boss 302R to Multimatic. I spoke with the Roush team manager while I was at LimeRock just before you arrived there Dan. Believe me Roush is not happy with the decision makers at Ford because of this. There is no company out there that even comes close to Roush when it comes to having the Racing manufacturing testing facilitys, race experience and resources at their disposal. Multimatic doesn't even come close. So because of this Roush is out to send a message to Ford by consistantly running up front using the old cammer engine instead of the new Boss302R engine which actually makes less power than the new Boss 302R engine.

Hi George ...yeah, I recall you telling me that. But if Multimatic developed the FR500C -- which is what Roush's #16 is -- and the BOSS 302 is the essentially the same Multimatic chassis -- right down to the welded-before-painting bodies -- what can be all that different in the chassis except for final prep? Admittedly Roush has tons of road-course experience and probably a couple 7-post shaker rigs in MI/NC for NASCAR development, so maybe chassis set-up is where they really excell -- dunno. And possibly also the drivers ...Roush jr is good and Johnson is awesome, so that might make a difference too. And we also know that Roush Sr has admonished jr to get out there and drive like means it.

As it turns out it's a good thing Roush has stayed with the the #16 FR500C 'cammer' based car this season because the BOSS302Rs have not been getting around the track as reliably or as quickly.

Will be interesting to see what August might bring :weg:

[68fastback]

Will the Performance of the forthcoming BOSS 302 come close to the '11 GT500?


Misses it by 198

:rofl3:

The SE supposedly will get the R engine -- complete with hollow valves, CNC-ported heads, and R-intake. If so, with the right tune (which Ford totally controlls because the TiVCT engine's management is totally new, different, complex, and inscrutable -lol) and given it's substantially lighter weight, it could potentially be faster than a stock GT500 -- if Ford wanted it to be. Will Ford put the R-tune in it from the factory? Not very likely, imo, not even in the SE version (even tho the engine may be idnetical to the racer). But I'd just bet FRPP will offer that tune as "off-road-only" since that would necessarily the basis of any private road-racer doing his own track prep off a Boss 302 SE base who didn't get in on the BOSS302R1 sale (tho I hear Ford will likely also do another round of R and R1 racer-builds for sale this winter). At least that's what I expect we'll have seen looking back maybe 8-12 months from now: street-BOSS, street BOSS-SE, and another round of race-ready (and race-only) only R and R1 offerings.

Put another way, what Carnut said ... vvvvv -lol


If they don't add a bunch of weight to it.

[JTB]

Thanks of the info. Dan but will the Boss302 be a hospitable Road car with AC and creature comforts or is this road version going to be DOT legal but really a Race Car with a plate, like The Cobra R?

[68fastback]

Dunno, JT.

I suspect the volume BOSS302 will essentially be an MGT with tweaked suspension, hotter tune, and some BOSS model-specific goodies, so it should have all the street amenities as options, like A/C, Nav, Sync, etc.

The BOSS302-SE R-build is anticipated to be quite small so might have a comprehensive delete package of some sort -- dunno. Engine wise it's essentially the engine homologation build for the R1 racer, but I have no clue how Ford might fit it up for the street.

I've heard FRPP will also offer the R1 engine over-the-counter as the replacement for the earlier 'cammer.'

I'd also expect all the R engines to be spray bore (like the Honsel 5.4) but could not get any insight on that -- the racing version of the 'cammer' (e.g. Roush's #16 FR500C) reportedly was from day-1, so I'd expect the 5.0R to be too, but no one was 'talking' on that, so maybe that's a 'surprise' -lol- or maybe not now.

[Birdman]

Hi George ...yeah, I recall you telling me that. But if Multimatic developed the FR500C -- which is what Roush's #16 is -- and the BOSS 302 is the essentially the same Multimatic chassis -- right down to the welded-before-painting bodies -- what can be all that different in the chassis except for final prep? Admittedly Roush has tons of road-course experience and probably a couple 7-post shaker rigs in MI/NC for NASCAR development, so maybe chassis set-up is where they really excell -- dunno. And possibly also the drivers ...Roush jr is good and Johnson is awesome, so that might make a difference too. And we also know that Roush Sr has admonished jr to get out there and drive like means it.

As it turns out it's a good thing Roush has stayed with the the #16 FR500C 'cammer' based car this season because the BOSS302Rs have not been getting around the track as reliably or as quickly.

Will be interesting to see what August might bring :weg:

Ford has and still is trying to get Roush to start using the new Boss but that effort is falling on deaf ears........and not because the BossR doesn't have the potential or the capability but because Roush Racing is sending a messge to both Ford and Multimatic . Remember Ford chose another company to cozy up to (SAI) to build "special models" (KR) and we all know how that worked out. In this case Roush Racing wanted the contract to build this car real bad and FMCO let them down with their decision to go with lesser qualified MM instead.
Right now that decision is proving to be a bad decision and Roush is out to ensure it. I was told as of now Roush has no future plans to ever use the BossR but the door is left slightly open in case they feel like changing their minds in the future.

[JTB]

So is it official that Multimatic will build the street BOSS 302? If so the street BOSS 302 will be :canada:
.

http://www.multimatic.com/mediacoverage/release.php?release=29

[68fastback]

So is it official that Multimatic will build the street BOSS 302? If so the street BOSS 302 will be :canada:
.

http://www.multimatic.com/mediacoverage/release.php?release=29

Multimatic builds the racers. Dunno, but doubt they'll build the volume BOSS. Maybe they'll do some of the SE Boss? Dunno...

[Birdman]

So is it official that Multimatic will build the street BOSS 302? If so the street BOSS 302 will be :canada:
.

http://www.multimatic.com/mediacoverage/release.php?release=29

JT that article is about the Boss302R which Multimatic won the biddig for over Roush Racing which is why Roush refuses to use the new 302R in GrandAm and also why Roush is kicking the new B302R's but in competition even with less HP using the old Cammer engine. They want to make a statement to both Multimatic and FMCO...

I believe the new Street version of the Boss 302 will be built in Dearborn, MI...USA

[68fastback]

Here's that clip from the Milville race when the announcer spilled Ford's beans. This has got to be the volume build at $30K he was referring to and that seems too low too!

He's also talking about the BOSS R1s while showing the Roush #16 (an FR500C 'cammer') which further confuses the viewer, I sure. Multimatic built the FR500C racers and builds the BOSS-R (Miller spec series) and -R1 (Conti Grand Am series) racers.

Someone on the other site posted that August 13 has a Ford world-reveal schedulled for LaGuna Seca 11:50-noon (I beleive) on Friday August 13. I could not find that on the Mazda/LaGuna Seca calendar so asked for a linky, but no details anyway.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zZ1sjNmdH0&feature=player_embedded

[Cobra Drifter]

Only 430 hp :nonono:

[68fastback]

...I think it's a game ...the R1 racer is only rated at 450HP but is believed to make in excess of 550.

Just speculating, but I'd expect the volume BOSS rated at 430 and the SE rated at 450 (add 100+ to the latter with FRPP 'off-raod' R1 tune) ...just speculating.

[68fastback]

Here's the linky to Laguna Seca announcement schedule mentioned earlier (http://www.mazdaraceway.com/pages/fan-reunion).. See the last two items at the bottom. I wonder if there's some connection between the Friday 11:50-noon announcement and the Dan Gurney seance honoring his achievements and the cars he drove -- the next day in the same location.

Coincidentally, Dan Gurney's #2 1969 Boss 302 racer was for sale on e-bay last month -- buy-in-now price was $1.1M.

Prolly just a coincidence... ?

...June 10 article on ebay listing (http://www.motorauthority.com/blog/1046019_dan-gurney-1969-trans-am-shelby-mustang-boss-302-on-ebay)
...more pics (http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/automotive-news-media-press/1286280-ebay-dan-gurneys-1969-ford-mustang-boss-302-trans-am-racecar.html)

[Cobra Drifter]

Yes its a coincidence :shrug: