Hameedi's "We'll build as many as we can sell" Comment

[Quagmire]

There are some smart people here whose opinions I value (not you, Tommy :tease2:) so I thought I'd ask what you all think this means.

I've been watching on several different forums, and quite a few people are taking this to mean that it'll be open order banks (or something similar) after the initial allocations are doled out.

I don't think that is going to happen. There may be additional allocations made available, but I think Ford already knows roughly how many they are going to build and that number won't be exceeded by much. Yes? No? What do you think?

I placed an order yesterday for a '13 at MSRP. Not a great deal, but I'm not paying an ADM either. The dealership has already received 2 allocations, both of which were sold with an ADM. My order was placed with no allocation at this time, but the sales manager is fairly certain that he has a 3rd allocation on the way and it will be mine. Yeah... At any rate, I've watched this guy operate over the past 3 years and he is very good at scrounging allocations, so I'm pretty certain that he'll dig one up from somewhere. For someone who really wants a '13 I'm actually fairly ambivalent about this. Either way it goes I'll be OK.

The sales manager also mentioned that the guy buying their 1st allocation (who is a GI over in the sandbox right now) is making noises about backing out of the deal because he has seen the "unlimited production" rumors derived from Hameedi's comment circulating on the internet and is feeling abused over the ADM he agreed to pay. So the hype is affecting dealerships, if only in a small way.

At any rate, what do you all think Hameedi's statement in terms of actual availability and production?

P.S. Just kidding Tommy Gun, aside from your views on Sync you're all right.

[68fastback]

Since MY'07 there has been a plant-mix limit on the GT500 and GT -- based off sales of the V6 ...possibly set as a result of CAFE-impact based on sales projections or posibly on supply contracts or other plant/line/supply logistics/constraints. For the last few years that 'limit' has been 6% of the total Mustang Flat Rock run. Prior to the new V6 in the Mustang, Ford had to stuff the dealers with V6s to make the mix. Even once the 5.0 went in the GT and the new 3.7 went in Mustang the 6% GT500 mix 'limit' remained (dunno what limit was for MY'07/8). Dunno if that's still the number for '13 since the early order guide I saw had no mix numbers.

That said my suspicions are that Ford will indeed make as many GT500s as demand warrants ...especially since 5.8 gets better mileage than the outgoing 5.4 and the 5.0 and 3.7 both get great mileage. My guess is that, even as awesome as the '13 GT500 is, given competition (and brand loyaltty) and the GT500's price points, that the market would not press the 6% mix -- if it still exists (I suspect one does, dunno what it is).

Dealers have to make certain commitments to even get allocatins for the '13 GT500 (tho not contrived as in the MY'07/8): a fee and staffing/training commitments. My guess is that once the initial round(s) of allcoations (to assure some parity across signed-up dealers -- I don't know of any other constraints as for MY '07/8) have run their course, Ford will allocate based on share-of-nation (total mustang sales at that dealership vs all dealerships) and will freely get additional allocations up to whatever total constraints might (or might not) actually come into play.

Since the beginning (including MY'07) I'm not aware of the GT500 ever actually being contrained by Ford -- estimates, guidelines, allocations, price and plant-mix limits all have still permitted any customer who wanted one to get one -- tho for MY'07 I strongly suspect that 'balance' was allocation-driven -- hence the opportunity for dealer ADM mischief which controlled the number of orders.

It's a complex dance that must be managed (and that I don't fully understand for sure) but my *guess* is the '13 and '14 will not bump the plant-limit and if allocations do become constrained then the dealers will control that, unfortunately, with price (ADMs).

Given what we're seeing so far (and given the competitive market dynamics too) my guess is it's not going to be a problem at all ...and that anyone who wants one will get one across MY'13/'14 ...many at under MSRP, moreso for MY'14. I suspect the above sort of logic is what underpins Hameedi's statement which I don't doubt at all.

[Birdman]

Quag,

First I want to say congratulations on ordering a 2013GT500....very cool indeed!!!!

I think Dan pretty much nailed it but I will say right now the dealers are somewhat negatively affecting allocation availability, mainly because they are holding out for MSRP and higher. Ford will not release additional allocations to the dealers until they have sold the allocations they initially got from Ford.

Another big factor which will affect the total number of these cars built is the $60K+ price tag on them in this economy. That will thin out the herd right there. As the year goes on the asking price will drop and deals will be had. I believe as long as there is a retail order Ford will grant the allocation if asked to by the dealer.

[Quagmire]

Thanks guys, I value your thoughts and opinions. At least I have a better feeling about my order eventually being accepted by Ford.

[Tommy Gun]

Why do you think there is something special about ordering a '13?

We've seen Ford build as many as wanted in the past?

I personally don't think one single one of the 2007 and up cars will be worth much of anything inside of 30 plus years.

What happened w the cars f the 60's is so much different from anything we will see in our lifetime.

I love everything about my car, the looks, the power plant, etc, but it will drop in value every year just as much as any Cobra of the past....so will the new Cobra's.

If you like (love) the new car, buy it. But don't think of it as an investment...it will never be.

I wouldn't bother getting it w that Sync crap though..... :shades:


.

[HSURB]

Why do you think there is something special about ordering a '13?

We've seen Ford build as many as wanted in the past?

I personally don't think one single one of the 2007 and up cars will be worth much of anything inside of 30 plus years.

What happened w the cars f the 60's is so much different from anything we will see in our lifetime.

I love everything about my car, the looks, the power plant, etc, but it will drop in value every year just as much as any Cobra of the past....so will the new Cobra's.

If you like (love) the new car, buy it. But don't think of it as an investment...it will never be.

I wouldn't bother getting it w that Sync crap though..... :shades:


.

Hey Bill, since you don't care for all of the Sync crap, I heard they're offering an second option for the navigation system on the 2013's. It's call iNavigate. It is an Apple product. There is quite a price upgrade, but from what I hear, it's well worth it.

HSURB®

[Tommy Gun]

Hey Bill, since you don't care for all of the Sync crap, I heard they're offering an second option for the navigation system on the 2013's. It's call iNavigate. It is an Apple product. There is quite a price upgrade, but from what I hear, it's well worth it.

HSURB®

Ford should offer this...

Like a Cobra R....offer to the public...no nav, no sync, no radio, 2 front seats, sound deadening delete, roll cage, air bags off switch, tuned suspension, etc etc...under $40,000. :shades:


.

[Tommy Gun]

Are you reading this Jamal?


Nice talking to you at VIR.


Still have your business card. :shades:



:rofl3:

[Quagmire]

No, I don't think it'll be worth more in 30 years. I'm buying mine to drive, not as an investment.

I'm just trying to cut through the hype (both ways) and figure out what availability really is at the moment.

[Gr8snkbite]

personally i dont see them producing anymore than they did of the 11's and 12's....

[Tommy Gun]

No, I don't think it'll be worth more in 30 years. I'm buying mine to drive, not as an investment.

I'm just trying to cut through the hype (both ways) and figure out what availability really is at the moment.

I'm just wondering...it's not like the '07's is there really a line to buy one?

The dealer I deal w seems to hav a hard time getting rid of their GT500's over the past couple years?

They sit in the showroom for months before some one jumps on one and they aren't marked up?

[Birdman]

I'm just wondering...it's not like the '07's is there really a line to buy one?

The dealer I deal w seems to hav a hard time getting rid of their GT500's over the past couple years?

They sit in the showroom for months before some one jumps on one and they aren't marked up?

This one is being treated differently than the 07's . By that I mean other than their first order the dealers can't just order 'stock' orders , Ford wants the order to have a customer's name attached. (retail order). Even though this year's model

[Tommy Gun]

I would guess then they don't want them sitting around unsold at the dealer, if you want one you need to order one.

Not that you wouldn't get one, just that they don't want to build one if there is no demand.

Pretty smart IMO.

[68fastback]

..possibly more so dealers don't order them just to go fishing on trades with magnet dealers at significant mark-up ...who in turn can get a big ADM. The instant they're driven off the transporter they're effectively sold to the dealer, but by controlling allocations based on end-buyer I think it limits opportunity for dealer mischief.

[68fastback]

This will be the first GT500 ever sold with Carroll's name on it but without Carroll...

...and possibly the last with that distinction too...

...so they will be the most valuable GT500s ever made :giggle:

...especially since they'll be the last of the 'hot rod' 'stangs :shades:

...so will appreciate from day-1 :haha:

[Stew]

This will be the first GT500 ever sold with Carroll's name on it but without Carroll...

...and possibly the last with that distinction too...

...so they will be the most valuable GT500s ever made :giggle:

...especially since they'll be the last of the 'hot rod' 'stangs :shades:

...so will appreciate from day-1 :haha:

Hey Dan,

I have some swamp land in Florida to sell and I think you are the perfect buyer for this outstanding opportunity. :rofl3:

[Tommy Gun]

This will be the first GT500 ever sold with Carroll's name on it but without Carroll...

...and possibly the last with that distinction too...

...so they will be the most valuable GT500s ever made :giggle:

...especially since they'll be the last of the 'hot rod' 'stangs :shades:

...so will appreciate from day-1 :haha:


Team Shelby is missing their village idiot and I think I just found him. :shades:

[Highwayman]

Like the previous years these also will be limited editions... limited to those who want to buy them :haha:

There are two things that will increase the value of any of the '07-'09, kids being aloud to drive them on the street and crashing them and people converting them to track cars never to be a street car again lessening the number of cars left :tiptoe2:

[Quagmire]

So the consensus is that Ford will build as many as they can sell, and will do this by handing out allocations to participating dealerships with open retail orders? I really hope this is true.


I would guess then they don't want them sitting around unsold at the dealer, if you want one you need to order one.

Not that you wouldn't get one, just that they don't want to build one if there is no demand.

Pretty smart IMO.

The problem lies in finding a dealer with an open allocation that is willing to sell at MSRP or below. I've called dealerships within a couple of hours drive and haven't found one meeting that criteria. A dealership can take as many retail orders as they want, but until Ford accepts the order (which they won't do without an allocation?) that car isn't getting built. Right?

At the moment my order is sitting there with a priority of 99, which I think means it won't ever be built. Hopefully Ford will dole out an allocation and pick the order up.

[Joe G]

Team Shelby is missing their village idiot and I think I just found him. :shades:Personal attack! :redcard:

[68fastback]

Hey Dan,

I have some swamp land in Florida to sell and I think you are the perfect buyer for this outstanding opportunity. :rofl3:


Team Shelby is missing their village idiot and I think I just found him. :shades:

:spitcopy:

[Birdman]

So the consensus is that Ford will build as many as they can sell, and will do this by handing out allocations to participating dealerships with open retail orders? I really hope this is true.



The problem lies in finding a dealer with an open allocation that is willing to sell at MSRP or below. I've called dealerships within a couple of hours drive and haven't found one meeting that criteria. A dealership can take as many retail orders as they want, but until Ford accepts the order (which they won't do without an allocation?) that car isn't getting built. Right?

At the moment my order is sitting there with a priority of 99, which I think means it won't ever be built. Hopefully Ford will dole out an allocation and pick the order up.

Priority 99 means it's in the dealer's system but do not build. I would ask them to change the priority to 10 or close to it (11-19 at the most). I would also push to get the dealer to ask the zone rep to request another allocation from Ford for your specific order. There are quite a few dealers around here that still have not sold their first allocation and they are asking MSRP.

[Quagmire]

OK, thanks Birdman. The funny thing is that I saw him enter the priority as 13, but the printout he gave me says 99.

He's supposed to be having a face to face with the zone rep next week.

[Tommy Gun]

So the consensus is that Ford will build as many as they can sell, and will do this by handing out allocations to participating dealerships with open retail orders? I really hope this is true.



The problem lies in finding a dealer with an open allocation that is willing to sell at MSRP or below. I've called dealerships within a couple of hours drive and haven't found one meeting that criteria. A dealership can take as many retail orders as they want, but until Ford accepts the order (which they won't do without an allocation?) that car isn't getting built. Right?

At the moment my order is sitting there with a priority of 99, which I think means it won't ever be built. Hopefully Ford will dole out an allocation and pick the order up.



Back in 2006 my GT500 was a priority 99.

It was the second allocation at the dealership.

They ended up getting 5 or 6 cars I believe?

I still think that was a whole different time than now.