Differential Gear Oil report

[Tommy Gun]

:(


15830


15831

[Joe G]

:surprised:

[Tommy Gun]

Maybe this is the problem? :tease2:



http://i670.photobucket.com/albums/vv61/fastestshelby2/2015%20Mustang%20mods/th_IMG_1140_zpsobbe4bez.jpg (http://s670.photobucket.com/user/fastestshelby2/media/2015%20Mustang%20mods/IMG_1140_zpsobbe4bez.jpg.html)

.

[Carnut]

Holy Crap, that doesn't look good. Wheel bearings/hub?

[Tommy Gun]

Holy Crap, that doesn't look good. Wheel bearings/hub?



No lug nuts :innocent:


Lol

[68fastback]

:surprised:

...for sure!

In case you need it: http://torsen.info/contact_information.htm

[Carnut]

No lug nuts :innocent:


Lol

Pesky squirrel steal them?

[Tommy Gun]

...for sure!

In case you need it: http://torsen.info/contact_information.htm



...for sure!

In case you need it: http://torsen.info/contact_information.htm


That would be cool if they were interested in taking it apart and seeing what is up.

Thought about asking Ford too, but doubt anyone cares.

I do still have the business card of the Ford engineer I met a couple years ago...

[68fastback]

That would be cool if they were interested in taking it apart and seeing what is up.

Thought about asking Ford too, but doubt anyone cares.

I do still have the business card of the Ford engineer I met a couple years ago...



:quitter: :haha:

Nothing ventured noting gained.

Possibly the Torsen folks have seen this before and have some insight into what specifically might be going on?

...aside from: "yup, gonna need a new one!" :shades:

[Carnut]

I'm just wondering since the rear end may have gotten hot and expanded various gears, it caused excessive wear. In that case the faces wore prematurely. Perhaps is now had the required clearance but if it got too hot, they faces may no longer be hard. Just saying. I suppose you could run hard again and recheck the fluid since the noise is gone.

[68fastback]

Bill, was that a new Torsen that you put in or was from the factory -- or one from the GT500 or TT1 or ?

---

I don't read back because I usually can't figure out what you mean :spitcopy:

[Tommy Gun]

:nonono:


Factory installed Torsen in the Performance Pack w only 5000 miles.

.

[onecrazydog]

:(


http://stangsunited.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15830&stc=1


http://stangsunited.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15831&stc=1




That sucks, but what great info from the report!!

[Tommy Gun]

:quitter: :haha:

Nothing ventured noting gained.

Possibly the Torsen folks have seen this before and have some insight into what specifically might be going on?

...aside from: "yup, gonna need a new one!" :shades:



https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/people/jamal-hameedi.pdf

:look:

.

[68fastback]

https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/people/jamal-hameedi.pdf

:look:

.

You called him? :giggle:

[Tommy Gun]

You called him? :giggle:


I could, I have his number and email.

I think I'll start w an email. :look:

State the conditions, state the dealer found nothing, and attach the reports. Just to ask him what direction I should go w this or who he would advise I contact.

.

[The Bone]

Did this car spend a lot of time on the dyno?

[Tommy Gun]

No, has been on the dyno before for 3 runs I believe.

[CH53Driver]

I told you to add water to the oil to help keep it cool. :look:

[68fastback]

I could, I have his number and email.

I think I'll start w an email. :look:

State the conditions, state the dealer found nothing, and attach the reports. Just to ask him what direction I should go w this or who he would advise I contact.

.

Just driven by a little old lady on Sunday ...can't understand it! :haha:

(don't let Hameedi see this thread -lol)

[Joe G]

:nonono:


Factory installed Torsen in the Performance Pack w only 5000 miles.

.

I blame the former owner. Probably some con man who beat on it then sold it to some unwitting dufus. :nonono:

[Joe G]

I could, I have his number and email.

I think I'll start w an email. :look:

State the conditions, state the dealer found nothing, and attach the reports. Just to ask him what direction I should go w this or who he would advise I contact.

.

You know what his current position is right? Doubt he'd even see it. Some Admin will forward it to a District Dufus to handle.

[Tommy Gun]

...

(don't let Hameedi see this thread -lol)



Why?

[Tommy Gun]

You know what his current position is right? Doubt he'd even see it. Some Admin will forward it to a District Dufus to handle.


What is his current position?

Far as I know, Global Chief Engineer over the performance division.

[Tommy Gun]

I blame the former owner. Probably some con man who beat on it then sold it to some unwitting dufus. :nonono:



I know what he did w/ the car because he had planned on keeping it.

Besides, how could someone abuse the car in a way that the diff would have issues within 5000 miles, other than hitting the dragstrip every weekend for a year which he didn't do?

.

[68fastback]

I blame the former owner. Probably some con man who beat on it then sold it to some unwitting dufus. :nonono:

:logical:


You know what his current position is right? Doubt he'd even see it. Some Admin will forward it to a District Dufus to handle.

:logical:

---

It's more fun letting Joe be logical for me. :yes:

:innocent:


Why?

...b/c racing nixes warranty? :innocent:

[Tommy Gun]

Who in the thread said the car was raced?

I never entered a race in it.

[68fastback]

...doesn't track use void warranty? I thought that's in the fine print ...I sure wouldn't mention it tho.

[Tommy Gun]

...doesn't track use void warranty? I thought that's in the fine print ...I sure wouldn't mention it tho.


Where would that be found?


I've heard rumors of "if the line lock feature is used, may void parts of warranty" , but have never seen it printed anywhere.

[The Bone]

Ford doesn't put something on a car so you cant use it to void a warranty. It may void the tire warranty but that's about it.

[68fastback]

...probably in the original warranty info that came with the car.

...yes they would ...run your GT500 down the track and if engine blows you're SOOL on the warranty. Ditto if you load a tune, etc. Ford tested for 100 passes but that doesn't mean it's covered under the warranty, just that they were performing due diligence that drive train is tough since owners understandably get pi$$y over such failures.

Don't you remember the discussions on this years ago on SU and TS? Fire up the way-back machine :hiding: If you tell them it was while on-track you're admitting you voided the warranty. Mustang GT is not a factory track car -- maybe GT350R is different ...or maybe not (dunno) ...GT350RCis made for track use, but has no VIN and probably not much, if any, 'fitness' warranty.

Of course if you have a good relationship with the dealer and such you can often get it covered. For an OEM to decline warranty work they have to reasonably show that the vehicle was used in a non-warranty-compliant way that caused the failure ...if you admit to on-track use you've effectively done that for them. Not saying what you should do, just cautioning.

[Carnut]

I think the words used are racing and or competition, that being said, I know NUTHINK.

[68fastback]

...I think you're right ...competition sure is a broad umbrella too. Lawyers are smart[a$$e$] -lol

[Carnut]

So if you are out for a Sunday drive and just happen to end up on VIR without competing with anyone, you should be home free. Take a picnic basket next time.

[68fastback]

So if you are out for a Sunday drive and just happen to end up on VIR without competing with anyone, you should be home free. Take a picnic basket next time.

:spitcopy: :logical:

[Tommy Gun]

I've never raced a car or competed in a car time trial of any sort.


I have both driven on public streets and participated in performance driving courses.


Bring it :flex:

[Carnut]

Sounds good to me. Let me know if I have to vouch for you.

[Tommy Gun]

Great

I guess a squirrel is better than nothing.

[Carnut]

Oh, and those lug nuts, probably in a tree somewhere.

[Tommy Gun]

:banghead:

[68fastback]

:lol:

[Joe G]

I've never raced a car or competed in a car time trial of any sort.


I have both driven on public streets and participated in performance driving courses.


Bring it :flex:

Race / time trial / performance driving course at high speeds on a dedicated race track for a weekend

Iceberg / Goldberg / If you think you have a legitimate leg to stand on you might as well send all of the details to your Ford contact since there's nothing wrong with it

[Tommy Gun]

I am

No reason a diff should fail so early, "if" that is what has happened.

[The Bone]

It should never fail just because he went to a road course. People drive them like that on the street.

[68fastback]

Most likely it was defective.

...or maybe Jay didn't change fluid on the recommended schedule for on-track use (or at all?) ...who knows?

...just cautioning that it might be 'unwise' to disclose how car was being used -- there's no need to ...so why unnecessarily put a bullet in the warranty gun?

[Carnut]

I still think you should just go run the piss out of and retake a sample. It ain't broke, would be the response from a dealer at this point.

[68fastback]

+1

[Tommy Gun]

Good thoughts

I bought the car thinking there was no warranty whatsoever anyhow.

Didn't know factory warranty extended to 2nd owner.

Just be nice if this was a defect somehow...that it would be covered.

Not trying to pull anything or be deceiving...just don't think a failure should occur at under 5000 miles :(

[68fastback]

Yeah, goes with the car ...should have 3/36 bumper to bumper and 6/50 drivetrain ...something like that.

Hope it works out well, Bill. I don't know what I'd do if it was me, i.e. share the report with Ford Writer to be on-record or just keep running it and see if metals continue to show.

I guess with only 5K on it there's plenty of time to go to Ford so you could always wait, run a few more events or the whole season and see what the nums look like then. If worse, it's time; if same might also be time; if considerably better, maybe it was a marginal unit that finally settled-in.

Seriously tho, did Tucker track it much (road or drag)? Are most of the miles just street miles? And did he ever change the fluid before? IF he did then the metals are almost surely showing AGAIN and that's more serious.

[Tommy Gun]

He ran on the track two days at different places, also with stock tires so didn't push it as hard as having track tires.

Car never drag raced.

Gear oil was original oil.

[Tommy Gun]

Email sent :look:

[68fastback]

He ran on the track two days at different places, also with stock tires so didn't push it as hard as having track tires.

Car never drag raced.

Gear oil was original oil.

Hmmm ...It's possible the gear oil was just breaking down ...I remember for the Boss 302S (the cheaper-the-the-R racer) which also had a Torsen, they were saying to change it something like ever four(?) hours on track. So maybe the next gear oil test might be much better now that you changed it. The noise is what's strange -- and amazing it went away after you changed the gear oil!

[Alloy Dave]

Email sent :look:
:waiting:

[Carnut]

Hmmm ...It's possible the gear oil was just breaking down ...I remember for the Boss 302S (the cheaper-the-the-R racer) which also had a Torsen, they were saying to change it something like ever four(?) hours on track. So maybe the next gear oil test might be much better now that you changed it. The noise is what's strange -- and amazing it went away after you changed the gear oil!

Sounds like the addition of a differential cooler might be a smart idea. I think the GT350R has one, maybe.

[Tommy Gun]

Sounds like the addition of a differential cooler might be a smart idea. I think the GT350R has one, maybe.


Get me a parts list, just can't find the details anywhere :(

[Tommy Gun]

:waiting:


Nothing yet.

Kinda figured.

Although I made sure not to mention Snoopy, Mini Me, EvilChris, Tommy Gun, Chip Whiskey, Father Guido, or David Copperfield :look:


Etc...

[Joe G]

Get me a parts list, just can't find the details anywhere :(

Here ya go. :tiphat:

https://mbtimetraveler.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/redneck-repairs-0.jpg?w=500

[Tommy Gun]

That's just stupid lol

[Joe G]

That's just stupid lol

:hey2:











:giggle:

[Tommy Gun]

:bunny:

[68fastback]

Sounds like the addition of a differential cooler might be a smart idea. I think the GT350R has one, maybe.

Optional on vanilla GT350 too. 2017s will all get all the coolers as standard equipment.


Get me a parts list, just can't find the details anywhere :(

Bill, Ford Racing should know part numbers ...it's among the three pieces here (http://stangsunited.com/showthread.php?8593-2017-GT350-Enhancement-Rumors-Looking-Very-Real&p=339813&viewfull=1#post339813)just not sure which.

[Tommy Gun]

You're missing the most important part and the hardest to install...the diff cover.

It is built into the rear subframe and requires a chunk of the subframe to come apart in order to install. :(

[Carnut]

3 items in picture, I think the bottom item is the oil cooler, the top left a transmission cooler and the top right being the differential cooler with what looks like a pump.

[68fastback]

You're probably right ...but I suspect there must be some 'radiator' to go with the diff pump though ...like with these factory 2013 GT500 TrakPak pieces:


http://stangsunited.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15959&stc=1

[Tommy Gun]

Still the problem w the 15-16 is the diff cover is a structural part of the IRS.

Meaning there most likely won't be a cover made w fittings for a cooler other than the GT350-R which I haven't seen or know if it bolts up the same as a GT.

[Joe G]

Still the problem w the 15-16 is the diff cover is a structural part of the IRS.

Meaning there most likely won't be a cover made w fittings for a cooler other than the GT350-R which I haven't seen or know if it bolts up the same as a GT.

Time to sell that POS and get a GT350. :moneyman:

[68fastback]

Time to sell that POS and get a GT350. :moneyman:

:spitcopy: :logical:

[Highwayman]

Time to sell that POS and get a GT350. :moneyman:

:hilarious:

[The Bone]

You could drill the axle housing and weld on some fittings for the plumbing. Must be a strong pump to pump gear oil.

[Tommy Gun]

Time to sell that POS and get a GT350. :moneyman:


I'm sure since Tucker doesn't keep anything very long I can get a chance at his next year...would have to sell both current cars though. :(

[Tommy Gun]

You could drill the axle housing and weld on some fittings for the plumbing. Must be a strong pump to pump gear oil.


When warm/hot it flows pretty good.

[68fastback]

Yup, and only needs to be pumped when hot (probably even has bypass valve for when cold).

[Tommy Gun]

No response yet :(

[68fastback]

To what?

[68fastback]

I'm sure since Tucker doesn't keep anything very long I can get a chance at his next year...would have to sell both current cars though. :(

Tucker's isn't an R but does have the coolers?

[Tommy Gun]

To what?


My email to Ford lol

[Tommy Gun]

Tucker's isn't an R but does have the coolers?


I don't even know the difference in the 2

[Joe G]

I'm sure since Tucker doesn't keep anything very long I can get a chance at his next year...would have to sell both current cars though. :(
Nah. Just work a full week vs. skipping Friday's and I bet you'll have a ton of extra cash by next year. :moneyman:

[Tommy Gun]

I need my Fridays off to take care of house stuff, buying supplies, finishing jobs I can't get to during the week, etc.

Friday is a busy day, but it frees up the weekend for us to relax a bit...in most cases.

[68fastback]

I don't even know the difference in the 2

GT350R has all the track goodies, bigger front splitter, special rear wing, CF wheels, lightened bits, and all the coolers (engine, trans, diff).
GT350 is the base model but coolers are an option -- Track Pak.

I was figuring if Tucker's has the coolers you could put the GT and his 350 on the lift and see how they implemented the diff pump & radiator and maybe score the part numbers you wanted.

I looked on the Motorcraft site this morning and they do distinguish GT350 rear axle assembly w/ and w/o "coolers" but the exploded diagrams for both appear identical ...right down to the part numbers -doh!

[Joe G]

I need my Fridays off to take care of house stuff, buying supplies, finishing jobs I can't get to during the week, etc.

Friday is a busy day, but it frees up the weekend for us to relax a bit...in most cases.


Not faulting you, just saying that you can't have both. Either work 4 days and have a 3-day weekend to relax etc, or work 5 or even more (a few Saturday's here and there?) to maximize your earnings to pay for things you want. You've said you won't be able to do this forever (you're getting old remember!! :giggle:), might as well earn as much as you can before you can't do it anymore.

I know it's a fine line between overworking and not enjoying your life and not maximizing your earnings now which leads to a TG who can't live the way he wants in retirement. I don't have the answers - but with an expensive hobby I'm sure that means there isn't much saving for the future like before.

[Tommy Gun]

GT350R has all the track goodies, bigger front splitter, special rear wing, CF wheels, lightened bits, and all the coolers (engine, trans, diff).
GT350 is the base model but coolers are an option -- Track Pak.

I was figuring if Tucker's has the coolers you could put the GT and his 350 on the lift and see how they implemented the diff pump & radiator and maybe score the part numbers you wanted.

I looked on the Motorcraft site this morning and they do distinguish GT350 rear axle assembly w/ and w/o "coolers" but the exploded diagrams for both appear identical ...right down to the part numbers -doh!

I think Jay told me he didn't have the diff cooler.

[Tommy Gun]

Not faulting you, just saying that you can't have both. Either work 4 days and have a 3-day weekend to relax etc, or work 5 or even more (a few Saturday's here and there?) to maximize your earnings to pay for things you want. You've said you won't be able to do this forever (you're getting old remember!! :giggle:), might as well earn as much as you can before you can't do it anymore.

I know it's a fine line between overworking and not enjoying your life and not maximizing your earnings now which leads to a TG who can't live the way he wants in retirement. I don't have the answers - but with an expensive hobby I'm sure that means there isn't much saving for the future like before.


I haven't cut back on any savings. Just started way too late and will have to work while you're off seeing the world and enjoying retirement. :look:

[Tommy Gun]

Someone else's email from Ford about coolers...

"1. We are putting together a couple of packages to help. One will be all of the OEM trans parts. The track pack/R trans, lines, heat exchanger, brackets and fasteners. We are looking to offer it at a discount from the price one would have to pay when trying to piece it together at a dealership. It still won’t be cheap. But it will be a good easy fix.

2. Next, we are investigating a package that adds an external electric pump along with modified production plumbing and the production heat exchanger. We have it wired to just a switch that the operator would need to manually control.

We will be testing system number 2 pretty soon to verify function. But it will be quite a while before we can have it in production.

There is also a diff cooler kit based on the production parts with a manual switch in the works that will be tested at the same time. Also likely months from production."

[Joe G]

I haven't cut back on any savings. Just started way too late and will have to work while you're off seeing the world and enjoying retirement.
:look:

Hope we both get to enjoy retirement - maybe even together every once in a while.

http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/friends/two-happy-friends-smiley-emoticon.gif

[Tommy Gun]

:surprised:

[68fastback]

I think Jay told me he didn't have the diff cooler.

Oh, okay...


Someone else's email from Ford about coolers...

"1. We are putting together a couple of packages to help. One will be all of the OEM trans parts. The track pack/R trans, lines, heat exchanger, brackets and fasteners. We are looking to offer it at a discount from the price one would have to pay when trying to piece it together at a dealership. It still won’t be cheap. But it will be a good easy fix.

2. Next, we are investigating a package that adds an external electric pump along with modified production plumbing and the production heat exchanger. We have it wired to just a switch that the operator would need to manually control.

We will be testing system number 2 pretty soon to verify function. But it will be quite a while before we can have it in production.

There is also a diff cooler kit based on the production parts with a manual switch in the works that will be tested at the same time. Also likely months from production."

Cool! I found a aftermarket pump online but it's a ryo arrangement.

[Alloy Dave]

I'm sure since Tucker doesn't keep anything very long I can get a chance at his next year...would have to sell granny though. :(
Fixed

[Alloy Dave]

I need my Fridays off to take care of house stuff, buying supplies, finishing jobs I can't get to during the week, etc.

Friday is a busy day, but it frees up the weekend for us to relax a bit...in most cases.I fully understand that. I have Tuesdays and Fridays off most weeks. Tuesdays are for things like doctor/dentist/haircuts and grocery shopping, etc. Fridays are my goof off/fun day. I do work about 30% of Saturdays but I get a pretty big premium so I don't mind it too much.

[68fastback]

:spitcopy:

Save her for the /R tradeup :lol:

[Tommy Gun]

Fixed


Already tried Craigslist.

[Joe G]

Already tried Craigslist.

:pimp:

[Tommy Gun]

So the Ford engineer responded yesterday that he would have his axle guys look at my results.

Today they responded that they see no need for concern or need to open up the diff for evaluation.

I'll go with that and be sure to stay on top of the oil changes. :wtg:

[68fastback]

:wtg: ...and if it goes south now you have a history to point to.

[Tommy Gun]

:hey2:

[68fastback]

:lol: Hope it doesn't but if it does it's a good thing to have that on-file.

[Tommy Gun]

:look:

[68fastback]

Ok, it's not a good thing ...what a dumb thing to have done :haha:

:sofa: :jk:

[Tommy Gun]

What :innocent:

[Tommy Gun]

The day my diff explodes I programmed this thread to disenigrate in 5 secs....

[68fastback]

:lol: